Convert-itis

I think perhaps the biggest area of cross-cultural misunderstanding, particularly among younger converts, is spiritual boundaries. They tend to expect \"seasoned\" (i.e. cradle and long-term convert) Orthodox to talk about things that should properly be discussed only with their spiritual fathers or their spouses. This includes questions about yours prayer life, why you do or don\'t receive Communion on a particular day, how often you go to Confession, how you keep the fasts, and the infamous \"Do you and you spouse abstain from sex during Lent?\" I realize this sort of overly personal question is asked out of childlike curiosity, but doesn\'t make you any friends! Please be sensitive to personal boundaries. If you can avoid the boundaries pitfall, you are well on your way to fitting in.

Yes! :cool:

I\'m not sure how come we only seem to hear about \'convert-itis\' in the Orthodox Church. People convert to other churches all the time....hmm. \\"-itis\\" means irritation. My husband has often included in his sermons an exhortation to keep loving the people who irritate us. Sometimes I remind him to also exhort the irritators not to lead the other people into temptation...:-) I am a convert of over 20 years now, and the enthusiasm of young newbies amuses me. I enjoy and love the simplicity and piety of many cradle folks as well. I can\'t however find much amusement in the elder brother types who sulk about what a great party the returned prodigals are having. Having a pile of zealous converts around your parish community is a lot like having a lot of children in the liturgy-- you are going to get some noise and embarrassment and distraction and discomfort happening. But don\'t you think the joy more than makes up for it? If you jump on them-- kids or converts-- just for being themselves, you may end up alienating them from the Church. And that would be to spurn the good gift of God. It would be to deny the apostolic command to go and make disciples of all nations. And maybe that\'s why only Orthodox seem to get \'convert-itis\'. We have been so busy conserving tradition for so long, we have forgotten that the whole point is to pass it on. Like kids and converts, it is alive.

Anjali, I can\'t speak for everyone, but it seems to me that \\"convert-itis\\" is simply \\"zeal without knowledge.\\" While that is obviously not something that only the newly-illumined are vulnerable to, in practice one sees \\"zeal without knowledge\\" more frequently among them (mostly, I think, because those of us who have been doing this for awhile all too often succumb to the opposite end of the spectrum and become lukewarm). Zeal isn\'t a bad thing (it\'s good and we need more of it, in fact!), and all these warnings about \\"convert-itis\\" are, I think, a reminder that our zeal must be tempered by sobriety and, most importantly, love. However, it often takes us quite a bit of time to acquire these two virtues for ourselves. For example, when my parents became Orthodox they were very excited and filled with zeal. They had been on a meandering spiritual journey and wanted *everyone* to know that they had finally found Christ\'s Church. But since their zeal was not tempered by sobriety and they possessed an as yet imperfect love, their efforts to share Orthodoxy with their friends and family all too often came across as \\"We\'re in the right church and you\'re in the wrong one.\\" Instead of piquing the interest of their loved ones they upset them and made them feel hurt and angry. Now, almost 30 years later, my parents have learned to temper their zeal, but this lesson came at a high price. We don\'t talk about religion at family reunions and such because too much damage has already been done... Even though sincere apologies were made, my family believes that Orthodoxy is about condemning others, and they don\'t want to know any more about it. Obviously that isn\'t the message my parents wanted to give to their loved ones, but in their abundant zeal they couldn\'t see that the way they were introducing Orthodoxy to everyone was only pushing people away from the Church and from them personally. They were so excited to get the word out, they didn\'t give any though to how they were communicating the word. That\'s only one example of \\"zeal without knowledge,\\" forgive me it\'s length! There is an even better explanation at [url=http://www.orthodoxinfo.com/inquirers/fsr_88.aspx]http://www.orthodoxinfo.com/inquirers/fsr_88.aspx[/url] I absolutely agree with the second part of your message. We need joy and zeal, we need to hold on to, as you put it, the \\"heady love phase\\" because it can make us better Christians. May God grant us zeal, and may He also grant us the wisdom to correctly use that zeal! Fr. John Moses recently had an excellent article in the \\"Return Magazine\\" section of this site called \\"In The Tumbler, or How I Attain Salvation,\\" and I think that it actually speaks to this subject. When people get \\"annoyed\\" with the zeal of the newly-illumned, or when the newly-illumined become disheartened over the \\"lukewarmness\\" of the \\"cradle orthodox,\\" we should go back and re-read this article because it\'s exactly what Fr. John is talking about. This is just one example illustrating that we\'ve all got rough-edges that need to be worked away, and we\'re all here to help each other to do that. That\'s how we\'ll be saved. Forgive me... Brevity is one more virtue I haven\'t yet acquired. Alexis

I suppose others have different and valid takes on it. Mine is an annoyance that some people are so quick to dismiss converts simply because they weren\'t baptized as an infant. It seems such an arbitrary distinction to make on how to decide who to ignore and who to disparage when really we should be doing neither.

After reading your reply I re-read my post and realized that it looked like I was singling you out. Forgive me. That was certainly not my intention. I agree with you, it is an arbitrary & silly distinction. The point I was attempting to make is that, even though such things can hurt our feelings and offend us, we can also use them as an opportunity for spiritual growth. Which isn\'t to say it\'s okay for hurtful and offensive behavior to run unchecked. Alexis

If you ignore a converts testimony ,then that gives you even less consideration,because some cradle orthodox act worse than protestants,or Bible thumpers.That just means they have the right to ignore you too.You may not realize that God may speak through some convert,and you may not be aware of it. God experiences love through us....His greatest Gift can be seen only if we open our\\" eyes\\"-not those trained on worldy things ....but those truly focused on God!

I\'ve read here that there is an opinion that converts are \\"over-zealous\\".But,does Christ not command His disciples,and those after,to be zealous with the Word of God,and preach the Gospel to all nations,races,and creeds.I believe that \\"over-zealousness\\",can,and is often confused with someone who sits there and force-feeds us with religion or dogma.Let me state that,as a convert TO Orthodoxy,I have experienced Orthodoxy and the Love of Christ,in a manner that words cannot express.It was for my soul\'s benefit,no one else\'s,except with whom I share God\'s testimony...through me,His Will is shown by the miracle of living on this earth,even though,like so many others,had \'beat the odds\'.As my parish priests(past&present)have told me,I do not have to justify why I am Orthodox (instead of a Methodist minister\'s daughter.)That\'sbetween God and I,unless aomeone is WILLING TO LISTEN.

Really?What sort of \\"crazy\\" convert behavior? If only one could keep themselves \\"young\\" and be wise at the same time,then you might have a strong argument.Some long-time converts and cradle-orthodox,can aptly be referred to as being bigots in a spiritual sense,that they think that newly-converted Orthodox christians,are like gnats or some bothersome pestilence,or as was the phrase \\"adolescents\\".By,the way,the last time I checked,the Orthodox Church has called itself the One True Faith....it\'s doors and it\'s people should embrace those coming into the Faith,as the Prodigal one,coming to reunite with his/her Father.

I couldn\'t have said it better,even though I did give it the \\"old college try\\".Very expressive ...in a good way.

Don\'t worry about it. I didn\'t take any offense to your post so I hope you don\'t think you did offend me.

OrthodoxRose, well said!

I don\'t think this is an accurate portrayal of the dynamics between people who grew up in Orthodoxy and those who come to the faith later in life. I think the tensions and skittish feelings happen because people are always most comfortable with what they know. Something new eventually becomes something accepted (from both sides) and those \\"clashing tendencies\\" disappear.

The question is , when do you stop being a convert and live every day as Orthodox ?

I converted to Orthodoxy about a year ago. Previously, I attended a Ruthenian Catholic parish for two years, and before that I was cradle Latin Catholic. I often wonder how the experience of a Protestant coming to Orthodoxy is different from that of a Latin Catholic coming to Orthodoxy.